Transcription

00:00:06 Introduction

Welcome. You are listening to Links at Bain and Gray.

A catalogue of podcasts centred on all things business support in the workplace. Our aim is to bring you interesting and relevant content, that will keep you up to date and thriving in your role.

00:00:23 Simone

Hi Emily, is that OK?

00:00:25 Emily

Good morning, Simone, how are you?

00:00:28 Simone

I'm very well, thank you. How are you?

00:00:30 Emily

Very well, thank you. I'm absolutely delighted to welcome you this morning to our Links, Presents. Simone, a little bit of background before we launch into our array of questions. Simone, you have, I would say, almost sort of picture perfect CV.

Looking through your A levels and then your masters at St Andrews, and then moving into retail and then spanning a few other industries across the way, including steel mining, digital advertising, and then ending up with what I would say is sounds like an absolutely dream job on paper. Currently EA to the CEO at MatchesFashion.

00:01:17 Simone

Yes, I have. I've gone across a couple of industries. I've gone full circle and ended up back at my first love, which was fashion, yes.

However, I have to say I really value the experience that I've had working outside of the industries as well, because like many EA's and PA's, most of our skills are transferable.

And I think actually just working with different industries and different types of management and styles.

Is really good as an assistant because it just broadens not only your experience, but your personality as well, because certain industries, for example steel is by nature very male driven, they have very different ways of requesting work and then how they expect it to be done.

It's a very proactive industry and very delivery driven. And then obviously fashion is a completely different beast.

00:02:14 Emily

Actually, just going back a little bit, Simone. So you actually, after you did your masters, you actually went on and studied fashion, is that right?

00:02:25 Simone

I did. It was sponsored by my first company that I worked for, so it was a part time sponsorship in Central St. Martins Beginners Fashion Design. Never any ambitions to go off and be a designer, but it was just a thank you from them for all the work I did to and they just sort of said we'd like to offer you to do a course in whatever interests you.

So I had free reign. And so that was really lovely.

00:02:51 Emily

So nice, and you obviously back then had an interest in fashion, but on the sort of commercial business side, I suppose what you've done has honed those two interests with your PA/EA background. So again, referring back to your CV, it's almost sort of picture perfect. Which is incredible.

00:03:15 Emily

What took you- Because I think you started….Was it Prada was one of your first roles?

00:03:19 Simone

That was the second role that I moved to. I worked in the in the store in Sloane St as a store administrator. Fantastic experience in that my first role in retail was for a wholesaler, so that was very much what I would call the back end, the commercial banking, the testing of the garments etcetera. And then when you go into the store, you're really seeing first hand customer service in terms of, up on the shop floor, in the office, all the calls that we used to receive and then you. Actually just really get to learn how a shop floor runs and I think that's when you work in retail, that's essential because you just see the mechanics of it.

00:04:09 Emily

Because you're right, I suppose in the head offices - and actually I started my career in retail office - you worked so far in advance as well. I remember discussing Christmas sort of, I don't know February! But you know, you sort of forget if you don't have that, that contact with the outside world, the very end product, like you said being on the shop floor, the selling in actually what the customer wants to experience, what to buy. That is the best way to learn, to see it at the at the end of the cycle. So you were on the shop floor in Prada and then where did you go after that?

00:04:34 Simone

So I was in the store in Prada and just the shop floor we had above us. But the good thing was that Prada had, very much, ‘everybody hands on’ approach.

So for example, if they were short of people on the shop floor, you would go and help out. I used to also help out with the cashiers if we needed extra cover, do the reconciliation of the banking at the end of the week, so fantastic.

00:05:09 Emily

Great team environment.

00:05:10 Simone

Yeah. And we had the glamourous bits as well when we used to do the trunk shows, so we used to organise that as well. All the invitations, getting all those all ready-

00:05:18 Emily

Simone, you're gonna have to tell me, what a trunk show is.

00:05:23 Simone

Sorry! So that's in between the main seasons. It's essentially for the very wealthy clients, when they have the cruise collections and things just before they go off for the summer sailing, as one does.

00:05:35 Emily

As one does! How amazing. Wow.

00:05:39 Simone

A mini fashion show with VIP's, top clients invited and the stores closed for the event.

00:05:47 Emily

Fantastic. And tell me, talk me through after Prada - where did your PA/EA role, where did that develop?

00:05:56 Simone

So after Prada, I very oddly changed completely and I went into work for Arcelormittal - which is a giant of stainless steel - and I went to work for a board member and I would say that ironically, this is where I really cut my teeth as an assistant because Arcelormittal is a huge company and responsibility, my first board member there was huge. When he retired, they replaced him with three or four other members, so it just was his work span.

00:06:28 Emily

Wow.

00:06:31 Simone

And very different way of working. The way they worked was that it was a very high volume of work, very detailed work and equally the mentality was: “we need: this, this, this”, they have no interest in how you get that information or get the work done, they just want to see the end result.

So, in that sense, I went from having a role which was very reactive, to really having to think on my feet, ask the right questions. My boss used to travel back-to-back weeks and sometimes months on end. So it was really intense and very difficult at first. But having said that, once you got going it was fantastic, because they just gave you a lot of parameter as well to take on extra things. If they saw you were good at something, you were allowed to take it on within your own bandwidth.

00:07:27 Emily

So it sounds like coming from a retail environment and moving into this environment, very different in terms of culture, pace, support, expectations, so-

00:07:38 Simone

Yes. And its very corporate as well, very different.

00:07:43 Emily

Was that something you consciously wanted to experience, or was it more that you were attracted to the person that you were working for? What took you in that direction?

00:07:53 Simone

I think at the time, I had reached a bit of a glass ceiling with Prada. With a lot of the retail companies, it's sometimes quite difficult to move into head office or to progress within your role. And so, when I was contacted for the role, it just was the possibility, to start right at the top of the tree as an assistant at board level. So it was very much being thrown in at the deep end, but also really being given an opportunity that was very rare, and work for someone at that level. And I just thought, ‘let's just go for it, what's the worst that can happen?’

00:08:33 Emily

Good for you. So it was sink or swim and you definitely swam?

00:08:36 Simone

Well, there was a lot of ferocious paddling going on underneath for the first six months. Very, very difficult initially, just huge inboxes to manage and just a completely different industry and culture. And I didn't come from an engineering background - so it was just a huge amount of information to process-

00:08:53 Emily

And you were there for a good, nearly five years, which is amazing. And what pushed you back into the more media world?

00:09:06 Simone

So when my final boss retired, his replacement was then in our Luxembourg Head office and he already had an established assistant. And during the credit crunch I had also inherited facilities management. So whilst I did it because it was part of my role and doing the credit crunch, I think everyone was just happy to have a role at that time. It wasn't an area that I wanted to stay in, so then there was no role left. So then I said ‘right, that's it, start again’ and I thought ‘I'm ready now to go back to the creative side as well’.

00:09:42 Emily

Yeah, I bet. So, before we sort of move on and bring us up to date in your in your career and where you are at the moment. What’s been the biggest hurdle that you've had to overcome as a PA?

00:09:58 Simone

I think for me, what's been very difficult, I've worked for many different types of personalities and principles, and I think what I have found very challenging, I have - and I'm sure every assistant has - I've had a couple of very tricky personalities to deal with and whereas now I'm 16 years in and I can handle it relatively very smoothly. When I was a bit younger and at the beginning, I found it very difficult. And I found it very hard to sort of separate that it was actually just them, and that they treated everybody that way. But I think our roles, you're so close to your manager, you're often the one who takes the brunt?

And I think to be honest, I find that very difficult when there's a lack of empathy for the amount of work you're doing, or there's a unnecessary criticism-

00:10:53 Emily

How have you dealt with that? Because that is that is a theme with the type of people in business support, the executives that they’re supporting. What tools have you used, and what advice would you pass on to our Links listeners for that?

00:11:14 Simone

I think the one thing that I've always had, and I think every really good assistant has, is that they have a level of emotional intelligence which is somewhat more attuned than other roles and other people perhaps? Again, I think that's both natural and also something that is related to the role and the type of work that we do, because we're obviously sometimes the main contact of that person. So I think that when I've had very difficult assistance, the one rule I always stay by, whether it's on my keyboard or in person is to just breathe, step back a moment, and just let that person vent, even if inside in your head you know that they’re wrong, and if you're lucky, they'll come back and realise. And then sometimes you just have to be as polite as possible and say ‘OK, fine, leave it with me’ even though you already know that what you're doing has been done.

And then often I've had them come back and say ‘I'm so sorry, actually, now that I've read through the trail, you did do this.’

00:12:18 Emily

Yes.

00:12:19 Simone

But in that moment you just need to let them vent, because they have a lot of pressures as well, particularly when you work at C-level, but also when you've got managers who are in charge of huge departments with lots of delegates, you have to just realise that sometimes you are that person that they're just going to take it out on.

00:12:40 Emily

Yeah. And I think, sadly, try and be an emotionally attached because, I think you're right. I think part of the good EA is you are so close to your executive. That they are, without thinking you’re gonna be the first person that takes whatever's gonna come at you. Yeah, and I think you just gotta be thick skinned and like you said, it's not personal. It's sadly part of the role. Talking about that what would you say has been your most challenging PA role to date and why?

00:13:16 Simone

I think probably Arcelormittal, just in terms of the sheer volume of work. And then also, as I said, when I inherited facilities management, I essentially inherited a manager's role plus an assistant role and it was just sort of having an invisible twin and at times it was very, very difficult keeping on top of the inbox, keeping on top of the priorities And also just trying to stay sane and finding a work life balance. Yes, that was that was difficult and that just sometimes required some extra planning. And just having a moment to think, right, OK. And also learning to delegate, because I think by nature a lot of assistants we take on far more than we need to, when sometimes we can just say, ‘let me find out from this person’, ‘let me share the workload’. So now I manage PA's and have done for a long time, but I also have the approach of divide and conquer and often we don't do that because a lot of us are perfectionists and I think it will only get done perfectly if I do it.

00:14:32 Emily

So you've learned the art of delegation.

00:14:34 Simone

Absolutely. And I find that quite hard because I tend to just want to do it myself. Just because then it's done really well.

00:14:41 Emily

I think I'm a little bit guilty of that as well, Simone to be honest, but that's again, about trust, isn't it? It's building up trust with your team and knowing that actually they'll deliver, and actually they might deliver it even in a better way. Some, things that you know, it can be different, but it could definitely be better.

00:14:47 Simone

Absolutely.

00:15:00 Emily

Again, one thing that I think you really stand out as an EA to me and at Bain and Gray, is that you seem to go into companies, and for whatever reason it is, your executives might change and I think you've done that most recently at Grey and then most recently it MatchesFashion and this, I think is a real skill Simone. Going into a role interviewing for a role, getting the chemistry with your boss and then suddenly inheriting another boss, and then perhaps a year later another boss, and you seem to be really good at this. And I think this makes you quite exceptional because I and I'd love to know your thoughts around this. I always think, as an EA, it's all about the relationship – somebody that you're supporting. Yes, it is about the industry. And yes, it is about the company, but primarily it's about the about the person, so perhaps we should talk about Matches, because that's what's happened most recently. Am I right in thinking you've had four CEO’s in less than four years?

00:15:59 Simone

That is correct. Well, three CEO's and one Executive Chairman. So yes, I started off with my first CEO. Unfortunately, after a year, he was moved on. I then had six months of looking after an Executive Chairwoman remotely, who was based in New York.

I then looked after the second CEO, just under a year later he was also replaced and I'm now on number three, and fingers crossed that's the last one for a little while.

00:16:33 Emily

They are so lucky to have you, because imagine the transition of coming into the business or coming into that role and having you there with the history, and just the sort of consistency, it must have been a massive help for them.

00:16:48 Simone

I mean, I have to say particularly now, the second and the third one, because obviously the first one, we both started at the same time I was brought on to look after him. But the second and third, I think for them it's almost having a calm person they can speak to who's got the background knowledge and particularly from my new CEO, well, not so new now, I was the only one left from the exec board within a couple of months of him starting, I looked and I thought ‘my God, I'm the only original one left!’

And yes, I think it's that background knowledge and also just being someone that knows the rest of the team and when he needs to find something out - we're a team of almost 400 in the Shard - so it's also he knows that I know who to go and ask, or where to find out the information from.

And yes, and I've built those relationships that have you need something quickly, I can get it.

00:17:45 Emily

Fantastic.

00:17:47 Simone

Yes, but yes, it's a lot.

00:17:49 Emily

Were you given opportunities? Because sometimes in businesses, you know at this level, people bring their own EA’s.

So were you given opportunities to be moved internally, or to leave, or… was this something that you grabbed with open arms and welcomed the change, or what was the sort of situation around it?

00:18:09 Simone

In this particular case, I wasn't offered any other role. It was just a case of, ‘here's your new CEO’. In the back of my mind, after the first time, I had that worry, I thought, because you often wonder if your new boss will bring their old EA, and I thought to myself every time I thought, I have my skill set, then I think to myself, each new person I go in as a blank sheet and I'm sort of think to myself, and say to them: ‘How do you work what works best for you? When should we speak to each other? When? When should we contact each other? When do we look over things? Which meeting should I join? What value can I add?’ And I think it's very important because, a lot of assistants, they don't change their way of working with their bosses and they almost get their boss to fit around their way, and then it doesn't quite work and I'm almost the opposite where I'm a bit of a chameleon, and even when I've had multiple principles, I have different ways of working with each one. Yeah, and in this case it's actually worked really well with my boss currently and the former one. I've joined lots of meetings I follow up the action points. He often knows that I've checked emails in his inbox, before he has, I flagged them to him. And it just works well, it's just building that sense of trust and sometimes building it very quickly, particularly when they're brought in. And then the teams are going to change again, they're going to relook at the structure. So you have to build that rapport very quickly.

00:19:50 Emily

Yeah. Do you think that now your career as EA, is always going to be in the luxury retail area? Now that you've dipped your toe in other areas throughout your career, but do you now feel this is what you feel most comfortable in?

00:20:08 Simone

I think I would definitely say within the creative field, having worked in steel for nearly five years, I believe that what's important to me now, particularly as my role has developed, in that I attend a lot of the senior meetings, I follow up on the actions. Right now. I'm now on the ESG core team at Matches that we're now bringing back to life, it definitely has to be an industry where I can understand what's going on because with the volume of emails and the meetings I attend, that's really important to me. I love fashion. I wouldn't say that I'm limited to only working in fashion. But it definitely would have to be an industry that I feel passionate about, and I would say that to any assistant really, that it's really important, particularly when you have inbox management. And when you're dealing with a big team, to learn as much as you can of the industry that you're in. You’ll keep on adding value, and it will also just enrich your life as well, because there's nothing more mundane than not loving the industry you're in.

00:21:09 Emily

Absolutely.

00:21:14

I agree with that.

00:21:17 Emily

Yeah, absolutely. And like you said, it's the adding the value, it's the extra bits as well. So that you can sort of always be one step ahead. So, Simone, am I right in thinking you're fluent in 2 languages?

00:21:29 Simone

Two, yes. So English and Spanish fluently.

00:21:30 Emily

Amazing.

00:21:32 Simone

And then French at intermediate level.

00:21:34 Emily

Amazing. So my next question is, what skill, if you could pick up a new skill - and this doesn't have to even be work related - but what would it be? What would you like to learn and what would you like to have in your bag of armoury?

00:21:52 Simone

I do love languages. I'm currently on going with Italian and I've started Mandarin which is-

00:21:58

Oh wow!

00:21:59 Simone

It's. Oh, it's a little bit crazy, but I have dyslexia, so I've actually got a very strong photographic memory. So when I'm going through the practise, it's quite good because I recognise all the symbols, but definitely if I could have a magic chip for languages I would love it. I love being to travel and go to countries and just speak a few words and just have that basic communication and that politeness and not having that stereotypical ‘Do you speak English?’

00:22:29 Emily

Yeah, it's a gift, isn't it? To be able to speak foreign languages. It's just it's amazing. So what three attributes do you think make a good PA?

00:22:44 Simone

I would say the core one, is organisation and granular attention to detail. I think a lot of assistants think they have it, and they really don't. Yeah, and I would say and that's from my working with assistants at the same level or managing assistant. You need to be a little bit OCD, because your bosses are basically you need to think of the fact that they're just relying on you to be their air traffic control.

Often they're not looking at the tiny details, they just expect it to be there, and obviously it will differ from principle to principle. Some of them are much more self-sufficient than others. However, I think whether it's the most basic thing when you're building an itinerary, or when you're working on a vendors conference or whatever it is. Thinking about plan A, plan B, plan C and having something in the back of your mind ready.

00:23:40 Emily

And then it all goes wrong.

00:23:41 Simone

Exactly as it will,100%. Yeah, I think that's really important. And again, emotional intelligence. I think, this builds with time and it comes with experience. But at the same time it's something you can work on. I think, I've always had it quite naturally, but then each principle I've had, I've picked up on small things. I know when they're stressed. I know when I have to manage people away from them in open their situations. When people come up and they often just want a quick word with whoever you're with, and just having that gravitas to say not right now. Come back. Pop me an e-mail. Or sometimes it's just getting that person a glass of water or popping out and getting them their lunch. Because you know that there's deadlines on, or that they've received an e-mail that's possibly. And just I think having that and knowing it, rather than just sort of doing the surface level work.

00:24:44 Emily

Yeah, yeah, I love the analogy about the air traffic control. I've never heard that before. And you are so right. Its perfect. It's absolutely perfect. So we're sort of coming to near the end of the podcast and just a couple more questions.

I mean I think our listeners will be so impressed, I mean you're just you come across so calm and so informative. And you're just covering everything. Everything is covered, which is wonderful.

What advice would you give to a young PA starting their career?

00:25:20 Simone

I would say, never underestimate yourself or the importance of your role. Very few roles in a company are as important for the success of your principle or principles as an assistant role, and I think it's very important to take pride in that, because unfortunately we are still in a bit of an era, where assistants are perceived, they're either hugely valued. Or they are perceived as sort of a 1950s, people don't realise how much power we actually have.

It can be a very lonely role at times, but I think the most important asset that you can have is, apart from the core skills, to be honest, to be discrete and be proactive. That's one thing, my boss comes out of meetings. I'll ask him, how did it go, any actions to follow up on. And he'll immediately he'll either say ‘No great, really happy’, or he’ll say ‘Yes’, sometimes I'll say, ‘By the way, you went into that meeting - does this now change the other two meetings or the other pieces of work has that been covered’. And it's things that he hasn't thought of himself. And sometimes he'll say ‘Nope, that still needs to go ahead’ and other times to be like ‘Oh no, that's great. Get rid of that.’

And it frees them up an hour, and then you're able to then go back to that person who would affect and say, look, this has been covered off, and obviously not diminishing because then they sometimes think ‘Oh I've lost my FaceTime.’ But you think ‘no, he's really happy with this. So we're going to move that a head a little.’ Yeah, really important. Ask questions. And I think if you're being asked to attend meetings and take action points, don't be afraid to ask for help afterwards. I've sat and done some meetings where I've come back and looked at my notes and I have thought ‘Oh my God, I don't understand what I've written down.’, because it's so detailed. And I've gone over it again and then when my boss has had a quiet moment, or the person most relevant to that meeting, I say ‘Can we just double check this?’ Keep learning.

00:27:26 Emily

Don’t be afraid to ask. Thank you so much. You've really provided nuggets of fantastic information and tips for our listeners and it's such a pleasure to talk to you. You've got a wonderful career and great insight, and you'd be a phenomenal mentor to somebody.

So thank you so much!

00:27:49 Simone

Thank you very much, Emily. Lovely to see you.

00:27:51 Emily

You too. Bye.

00:27:52 Simone

OK, bye.